Scores by kind of claim
Each kind of claim is scored on its own, out of 100: the share that held up, with the range it likely falls in. Fewer resolved claims give a wider range.
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Factual claims
Statements about the present or the past, checked against the record: did they hold up?
71 64 78 -
Predictions
Statements about events outside the person's control, checked once they fell due: did they come true?
Insufficient record: 0 predictions resolved, 5 needed for a score.
All types combined: 71 (likely 64 to 78, medium confidence), from 55 claims: 55 factual claims. It mixes kinds of claim in different proportions for different people, so compare people kind by kind.
Peter Thiel's claims
“In America, people are imprisoned for using even very mild drugs, tortured by our own government, and forced to bail out reckless financial companies.”
Peter Thiel, essay author 1 May 2009 Your Suffrage Isn't in Danger. Your Other Rights Are. (Cato Unbound)
In America, people are imprisoned for using mild drugs, tortured by the government, and forced to bail out reckless financial companies.
Mostly true True in substance, wrong in a detail.
The second judge would not resolve this claim; the verdict shown is the first judge's.
What would count as true or false
Judge each of three parts as of May 2009: (1) people in the US were imprisoned for use or possession of mild drugs such as marijuana; (2) the US government subjected people to torture (e.g. waterboarding or 'enhanced interrogation' of detainees, as described in official documents or by the Obama administration, the Senate or major human-rights bodies); (3) taxpayers were made to fund bailouts of financial firms that took excessive risks (e.g. TARP, the AIG rescue). True: all three are documented. Mostly true: all three are substantially documented, with a minor overstatement (e.g. incarceration for mere use was rare compared with possession or distribution charges, or the torture was of foreign detainees, not citizens). Mixed: two of the three hold and one is clearly unsupported, or the evidence on two is contested. Mostly false: only one holds. False: none holds.
Evidence
- The Tragedy of Victimless Crimes in the United States Prison Legal News (reposting Time for Change's post from Democratic Underground) · 9 June 2009
“Of the total U.S. prison population in 2004, more than one quarter, 530,000, were imprisoned for drug offenses, and almost a tenth of these were for marijuana only. Many of those were for mere possession, rather than manufacturing or selling.”
- The Tragedy of Victimless Crimes in the United States Prison Legal News (reposting Time for Change's post from Democratic Underground) · 9 June 2009
“For example, of 700,000 marijuana arrests in 1997, 87% were for mere possession, and 41% of those incarcerated for a marijuana offense are incarcerated for possession only.”
- The Report of The Constitution Project's Task Force on Detainee Treatment Project On Government Oversight (POGO), summarising The Constitution Project's Task Force on Detainee Treatment · 2013
“The extensive research that led to the conclusion that the United States engaged in torture is contained in a detailed legal memorandum attached to this report.”
- United States: Investigate Bush, Other Top Officials for Torture Human Rights Watch · 11 July 2011
“President Bush publicly admitted that in two cases he approved the use of waterboarding, a form of mock execution involving near-drowning that the United States has long prosecuted as a type of torture.”
- The Tragedy of Victimless Crimes in the United States Prison Legal News (reposting a post by 'Time for change', originally on Democratic Underground) · 9 June 2009
“Of the total U.S. prison population in 2004, more than one quarter, 530,000, were imprisoned for drug offenses, and almost a tenth of these were for marijuana only. Many of those were for mere possession, rather than manufacturing or selling.”
- Decades of Disparity Human Rights Watch · 2 March 2009
“In every year between 1980 and 2007, arrests for drug possession have constituted 64 percent or more of all drug arrests.”
- United States: Investigate Bush, Other Top Officials for Torture Human Rights Watch · 11 July 2011
“President Bush publicly admitted that in two cases he approved the use of waterboarding, a form of mock execution involving near-drowning that the United States has long prosecuted as a type of torture.”
- The Report of The Constitution Project's Task Force on Detainee Treatment Project On Government Oversight (POGO), reprinting the Constitution Project Task Force report · 2013
“Their definitive finding “that it is indisputable that the United States engaged in the practice of torture” was an important step toward reconstituting a bipartisan consensus against torture in the United States.”
- Torture Memos Released CBS News · 16 April 2009
“In one of my very first acts as President, I prohibited the use of these interrogation techniques by the United States because they undermine our moral authority and do not make us safer.”
- Justice Department Releases Bush Administration Torture Memos | American Civil Liberties Union American Civil Liberties Union · 15 April 2009
“the Justice Department today released four secret memos used by the Bush administration to justify torture.”
- ACLU Obtains Key Memos Authorizing CIA Torture Methods | American Civil Liberties Union American Civil Liberties Union · 23 July 2008
“These documents supply further evidence, if any were needed, that the Justice Department authorized the CIA to torture prisoners in its custody,”
- Ongoing Government Assistance for American International Group (AIG) Congressional Research Service (via EveryCRSReport.com) · 18 March 2010
“had been forced to seek up to $173.4 billion in financial assistance from the U.S. government.”
Reasoning
On part 1, an opinion piece reprinted by Prison Legal News says many people imprisoned on marijuana charges were held for possession alone, and that 41% of those incarcerated for marijuana were held for possession only (E1, E2). Human Rights Watch data show that possession made up most drug arrests through 2007 (E6), but this support is weaker than for the other parts and concerns possession rather than use. On part 2, the April 2009 release of the interrogation memos, President Obama's ban on the techniques, President Bush's admission that he approved waterboarding, and the Constitution Project's finding of torture document it (E9, E10, E11, E4, E8). On part 3, the Congressional Research Service records that AIG had been forced to seek up to $173.4 billion in financial assistance from the US government (E12), so all three parts are substantially supported, with a minor overstatement in that the drug evidence concerns possession rather than use as such (E2).
Cite this claim
Peter Thiel, “In America, people are imprisoned for using mild drugs, tortured by the government, and forced to bail out reckless financial companies.” (said 1 May 2009). Verdict: mostly true. Reliability API, claim c_c223ad6447c0, method 0.1.0+3e03e2df. https://epistacklabs.com/claims/c_c223ad6447c0
Claims without a verdict
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